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Post by Brochfael on Sept 2, 2005 6:47:49 GMT -1
Iolo Morgannwg described three circles of being:
Annwn, Abred and Gwynfed.
I have heard these explained respectively as:
The realm of the dead, the realm of the living and the realm of the gods,
or
The primordial soup, everyday reality, the higher realm to which we aspire.
My question is this:
Is the whole three realm thing another bit of Iolo's imagination and if not what is the "correct" interpretation of the three realms?
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Post by goldenhand on Sept 10, 2005 8:59:00 GMT -1
The answer is, I don't know! I've not come across anything that is earlier than Iolo. On the other hand, it feels like its right.
I've heard them described differently again - that the circles are called Abred, Gwynfid and Ceugant. Day to day, we live within the circles of Abred, but can ascend to Gwynfid if we become enlightened during our physical lifetime. Ceugant is a purely non-physical realm, we cannot reach it until our bodies are cast aside.
Blessings,
Angharad
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Post by beithann on Sept 13, 2005 11:40:02 GMT -1
You know, I have come across this recently and would like to know more, although I had heard that Iolo had lost a lot of credibility when I was newer to the craft.
The other thing that I am trying to find out about it Cythrawl (not for any personal reasons you understand!). He is said the be 'Chaos' and the opposite to God, but I was wondering if this is the whole of his biography or where there were any other texts about this whole God/Cythrawl thing that would give more information
BB
Beith
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Post by Blackbird on Sept 13, 2005 13:09:53 GMT -1
I've been keeping out of this one. In the absence of any evidence other than Iolo's, you either take his word - or not. Like Angharad said, it feels 'authentic' - but then, such was the gift of Iolo Morganwg. If his forgeries were easily detectable, then he wouldn't cause such problems to us.
Re. Cythrawl, I've no idea! I've only seen the word translated as 'devil', so assumed it was the typical Yahweh/Satan thing.
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Post by beithann on Sept 13, 2005 22:58:01 GMT -1
Looking a bit more deeply, it seems that the only mention of Cythrawl and the 3 circles of being are mentioned in the Barddas and it seems to be a mix of Welsh heros and Christian spirituality and no later than 16(c) This seems to be a good link www.maryjones.us/jce/barddas.htmlmentioning the book and linking to a scanned copy of both volumes BB Beith |
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Post by Blackbird on Sept 15, 2005 6:57:31 GMT -1
Yes - as I said in my previous post, the only evidence comes from Iolo Morganwg, so it might not predate the 18th century.
I love Mary Jones' site, lots of good stuff on there! And as we found last year, there is a good copy of Barddas available from Amazon at the moment. Definitely worth having for the bookshelf.
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