Stonehenge?

[Blackbird]

Stonehenge is a place which stirs up strong feelings among many people for various reasons.

For some, Stonehenge is a megalithic Mecca, the only place to be at the solstices. For others, the energy there is offputting, or the place just too busy.

Some think it a temple, others an observatory. Some think it to be the home of Merlin, for others it is the Dance of Giants.

And what is the significance of the blue stones, brought from the Preseli hills? Were these once part of another monument?

How was it built? By humans, Gods, giants or aliens? ;D

These and other questions can be discussed here

[siaron]

I was very intrigued by the recent discovery of the so-called "Boscombe Bowmen" near Stonehenge, and their ties to Pembrokeshire (home of the Preseli Mountains where the famous bluestones are from). It is speculated that they participated in the construction on at least some phase of the monument. Radioactive isotope levels from their dental enamel traced them to their original home in South Wales.

See this link for more information if you're not familiar with this story:

www.crystalinks.com/stonehenge2.html

Do you agree with this assessment? I have to admit the prospect is quite exciting. I have been to Stonehenge on several occasions; frankly, for me the soul of the place is hard to find under the crushing weight of the tourist trade. I much prefer Avebury or West Kennet Longbarrow for 'soul'. But Stonehenge will always be the biggest and most famous of the ancient sites, so I must give it fair dues. It is spectacular, an amazing feat of engineering.

[sulla]

Last August I arranged a private access visit to Stonehenge, where there was a maximum number of people (12 I think) and you were allowed actually inside the circle. I don't think standing on the footpath and viwing the stones from afar can really match being in amongst them and touching them. I had to leave Plymouth at 4.30 am to get there for 7.30 am but it was well worth it. I was totally in awe.

[blackwitch]

wow that must have been amazing, i've never even been to stonehenge but would love to go one day. it is a magical and special place to me.

bb moira

[Blackbird]

I've never actually stood within the stones, only looked in from the perimeter fence. Though I acknowledge the great importance of the place, it has never pulled me in the same way that local sites here do. I think that when you are in close proximity to a place, as you feel your connection to places, to the land... you become part of each other, in a way. That doesn't happen to me with stonehenge. There is a deep sense of it not being 'mine'.

[siaron]

Thanks Blackbird, you said what I was feeling so much more eloquently. There is no connection for me.

Now, other places just shake me to my core. The first time I went to West Kennet Longbarrow, I went into one of the little 'cells' inside and sat down and did not want to come out. Ever.

Later, I went up and sat on top and looked out over Silbury Hill towards Avebury. It was a beautiful day, with a gentle breeze. I closed my eyes, and it was like I was transported--where, I don't know. But I had the most intense 'hiraeth', and I just started crying and crying. It was like I missed being in that place. And it was my first time visiting the UK, hadn't been to Stonehenge or anywhere else...except White Horse Hill (which also affected me deeply). It was a strange reaction, especially since I had never been to that part of Britain. It felt like home.

But when we went to Stonehenge, I didn't feel anything in particular. Maybe if I was able to actually go inside the circle itself....

[Blackbird]

I'm glad that what I was trying to say came across It's something that's hard to put into words. I also understand the strong feelings that you describe. The White Horse is definitely one of those places for me too, as is Silbury.

Up here, it is just the Peaks generally, rather than any specific place in them. For those unfamiliar with the Derbyshire Peaks, they are littered with stone circles, cairns and barrows of various shapes and sizes. The sight of the sun setting behind a hill which is crowned with barrows is indescribable. Many of my family come from that area, so perhaps its not surprising that I feel a pull there.

[morgaine]

Greetings!

I too have been in Stonehenge during a private access, and this much I can say: for anyone who has stood within it and chanted, it is immediately apparent that one purpose was related to sound and accoustics. The image that came to my mind was of a sort of celestial oratory.

In contemplation,
Morgaine

[Blackbird]

That's an interesting comment, given the possible connection between Stonehenge and the 'Temple of Apollo' mentioned by Hecataeus of Miletus. All immensely speculative of course

[Sìle]

Francis Pryor reports on a vast archaeological project in Wiltshire, where a team led by Prof Mike Parker Pearson is challenging existing theories about the Neolithic society that built Stonehenge, the reason for the site's location and its purpose.

Secrets of Stonehenge - listen again available for this programme which originally aired on 20 February 2008.

[Midori]

Heard this, it regards the area where the Bronze Age Living History Group (set up by our own Brochfael) show their stuff at the Open Days.

Very interesting.

cheers, Midori

[Tegernacus]

could someone paraphrase or rip an mp3 of this show? I don't have Realplayer, or any intention of installing it (grrr bloaty spyware). Diolch!

[poseidia]

Thanks for the BBC programme link. The Durrington wall dig is fascinating.

I guess you guys have worked out by know that I work from an assumption that our ancient histories are our best source and could well be right and conversely I'm sceptical about modern day views and scientific methods particularly the wholly unreliable carbon dating methods.

Durrington Walls were (according to carbon dating methods) built in the Neolithic period (around 3100-2400BC). Excavations in 1967 revealed two circular timber structures and vast quantities of animal bones which could indicate that feasting took place there.

Well our lore tells us there was indeed a huge feast there to celebrate the truce between Saxons and Britons. However, the Saxons betrayed the trust of the Britons and slaughtered their British hosts almost to a man. Merlin suggested that the only fitting monument would be to bring the African healing stones from Killaraus (Uisneach) in Ireland.

However, would you have built that monument on the holy ground where the Britons fell or would you build it somewhere nearby. Perhaps they chose to build it nearby on high ground to mark the spot for the thousands of people who would have wanted to pay their respects to their national leaders.

Of course, the ruling Saxons in later years would hardly have any interest in maintaining that history as it reflects such cowardice and shame on the Saxon race and the victors write the history. Lets face it even today it is an unpalatable history for the English to accept - much easier to ridicule it - a bit like the atrocities prompted by "Saint" Augustine to the druids/monks of Bangor-on-Dee at the battle of Chester, much easier to ignore that slaughter and pretend Augustine was a saintly figure.

Read "Carbon Dating - the controversy" at
www.allaboutarchaeology.org/carbon-dating.htm

[littleraven]

A discussion about the mytho-history of Stonehenge is always interesting, but do you *really* believe Merlin brought them from Ireland?

poseidia said:

Of course, the ruling Saxons in later years would hardly have any interest in maintaining that history as it reflects such cowardice and shame on the Saxon race and the victors write the history. Lets face it even today it is an unpalatable history for the English to accept - much easier to ridicule it - a bit like the atrocities prompted by "Saint" Augustine to the druids/monks of Bangor-on-Dee at the battle of Chester, much easier to ignore that slaughter and pretend Augustine was a saintly figure.

No, these monks (Druids?) weren't killed by Augustine, they were killed by Aethelfrith. IIRC it was Bede who suggested they were the subject of divine retribution for failing to submit to the rule of Augustine as initially sanctioned by the pope. The battle is dated to 616, Augustine died in 605. Incorruptable or not he would have been a little too frail by then.

[Tegernacus]

There isn't any evidence that Brad y Cyllyll Hirion took place at Durrington. Or Stonehenge. Or .. anywhere, really. "Nennius" just says that the Saxons set up a feast for Vortigern and his chiefs.

Carbon dating isn't 100%, nothing ever is, but then archaeology doesn't just use one method to reach its conclusions. Carbon date + pottery styles + soil deposits + stratigraphy etc etc. The evidence, when taken together, helps these experts reach the conclusions they do.

Btw, I wouldn't trust anything from a "Biblical Archaeology" site... Dinosaurs, lions, and humans all living together yadda yadda.

Current theory seems to be that there was some kind of mass gatherings at Durrington, before formal processions to Stonehenge. But they said that about Woodhenge too. Truth is, no-one knows, but with every little scrappy piece we get a better shot at the puzzle.

[poseidia]

Again I'm afraid I work on a spiritual level rather than an academic level. (My degree is in law of all things). I have witnessed wonders in my life way beyond any matter of fact explanation and I am therefore happy to consider possibilities which others clearly won't be. I have visited Uisneach in Ireland and it feels rights to me. There is one solitary huge block of stone remaining on the side of the hill sort of out of place with the rest of the greenery. It is the seat of the old Kings of Ireland, and the centre of the Druid fire cult. It is totally unexploited by visitors - in fact visitors are positively discouraged. I recommend a visit - ignore signs saying the land is poisoned and inhabited by killer bulls. Also notice that the sign describing Uisneach to the visitor is on the wrong side of the road.

There is a lot of evidence for the use of anti-gravity techniques known to the ancients but long forgotten. For a great explanation of gravity from the non-estabishment view - written in a totally common sense way try WalterC Wright's book - "Gravity is a push". Now I'm not saying that I believe in this stuff but I am always open minded to every possibility.

I don't remember opening a discussion about dinosaurs and humans living together however I agree with every scappy little piece we will get a better shot at the puzzle. Just don't bin pieces, because you may find you need them as the puzzle progresses.

[Tegernacus]

No, I don't discount anything out of hand. If they could have levitated the stones, then fantastic. But then they wouldn't have had to gather together the largest group of neolithic people in Northern Europe in order to quarry and drag them to the henge site (Evidence for which is emerging at Durrington).

Interesting that you should mention Uisneach. Theory is that the reason that Stonehenge is where it is, is because after the ice-age, when people came back into Britain, they found this huge stone on Salisbury plain, and took it to be a sacred place. They built huge totem poles near it, rings and henges, buried their dead around it, culminating in the massive stone circle we see today. That stone was the "heel stone", which, if you take it back to it's pre-henge context, looks not unlike the cat-stone at Uisneach (in that it is a huge lump of stone in an area where this isn't commonplace). Hmmmm.... *lightbulb goes on*

Btw, I managed to grab an mp3 of that Stonehenge show. If anyone hasn't got realplayer but would like to hear it, shoot me a PM and I'll email it to you (I assume you've paid your telly licence lol)